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> The cup of water, In reality
Type-M
Posted: Feb 12 2008, 09:05 PM


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Do you think that it is possible in real life to drive quickly/drift and "stir" the water in the cup and not spill any as Takumi does?

This post has been edited by Type-M on Feb 12 2008, 09:05 PM
twitchykun
Posted: Feb 12 2008, 09:26 PM


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I've tried it. Maybe it's the fact that my car then, and my car now are FF cars, but it seems a tad difficult. Then again, Initial D is a manga/anime/cult, so you really should take everything they say with a grain of salt.

Try it out for yourself and see if it's hard or not. Go on! Fill up a paper cup with water and try drifting around, hell, just try driving around with it.
Type-M
Posted: Feb 12 2008, 09:42 PM


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QUOTE (twitchykun @ Today at 9:26 PM)
I've tried it. Maybe it's the fact that my car then, and my car now are FF cars, but it seems a tad difficult. Then again, Initial D is a manga/anime/cult, so you really should take everything they say with a grain of salt.

Try it out for yourself and see if it's hard or not. Go on! Fill up a paper cup with water and try drifting around, hell, just try driving around with it.

I would but my car dosn;t have a cupholder in it laugh2.gif
DeeezNuuuts83
Posted: Feb 12 2008, 09:49 PM


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I haven't tried it (on purpose), but theoretically it just seems so difficult to the point where I'd wonder if anyone could seriously pull that off. It's almost as if anytime you change direction, the water MUST rotate within the cup, otherwise it'll spill... and I would guess that would require the car itself to rotate as well, as just cornering would probably make the water go over the edge of the cup.
WRX DEMON Type R
Posted: Feb 12 2008, 10:18 PM


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I used the water cup method thingy... But not for drifting... I used it to teach me how to shift more smoothly. It works for that.
AzNMaVbOi
Posted: Feb 12 2008, 10:37 PM


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Strangely enough, my brother has tried it, but unwillingly. When he took his behind the wheel exam 9 years ago, the proctor actually placed a hot cup of coffee on the dash and told him, "if this spills, you fail." He obviously wasn't driving fast though, so I don't know if that actually applies.
DeeezNuuuts83
Posted: Feb 12 2008, 10:48 PM


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QUOTE (WRX DEMON Type R @ Today at 11:18 PM)
I used the water cup method thingy... But not for drifting... I used it to teach me how to shift more smoothly. It works for that.

I don't think a cup of water would help you shift more smoothly... the jerks, whether slight or violent, are pretty good indicators of smoothness.
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Posted: Feb 12 2008, 11:38 PM


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Well, it worked for me. It helped me overcome the AWD THUD most new Impreza owners experience when upshifting.
Meteor
Posted: Feb 13 2008, 12:16 AM


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At low speeds (10 km/h, 20 km/h and the like), it's relatively easy. Not easy for those who just started driving, but relatively easy.

As for higher speeds. I don't know about that. But Takumi has said that he can't go as fast uphill because of the water in the cup. The only time he truly drives fast is when he's returning from the delivery. So I think it's possible, just a bit difficult.

Takumi probably does it like this:
.brakes lightly before turn
.gradually increases braking, heel-toe downshift
.trail-brakes into turn, then applies a little throttle while continuing to steer lightly (he doesn't need to apex the turn as it won't help him with his tofu)
.gradually decreases steering as he nears the exit
.smoothly pushes right foot down on accelerator after exiting the turn

Atleast that's what I think.

But yeah.
QUOTE
Initial D is a manga/anime/cult, so you really should take everything they say with a grain of salt.


This post has been edited by Meteor on Feb 13 2008, 12:21 AM
redgreen
Posted: Feb 13 2008, 01:25 AM


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I guess everything is theoretically possible.
there are lots of things, that i wonder if it is possible. The open gutter drifting from ep2 of the fourth stage seem pretty close to impossible but theoretically possible.
As for the cup of water, i guess Takumi probably has super senses, since he's concentrating on driving so fast while watching how the water is moving.
Gabzor
Posted: Feb 13 2008, 01:50 AM


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it should be pretty hard to do, my friend is an intial d fanboy, he has an s14, he sort of thinks initial d can help in real life driving, so i put a cup of water in his cup holder, we were driving around canyons.. it was going okay on low speeds, first corner.. water spilled.. then we hit a little bump.. water got all over my pants -__-
yooN-
Posted: Feb 13 2008, 06:28 AM


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lol
i didnt know anyone even cared about the water thing
but that would be cool though if u could drive as fast as takumi and like no spill a drop
but yea
like ppl said it's just a anime and work of fiction
Tessou
Posted: Feb 13 2008, 09:28 AM


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Where's Tsuchiya when you need him? I'm sure he'd be up to the challenge... shifty2.gif
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D3MON
Posted: Feb 13 2008, 09:40 AM


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QUOTE (Tessō @ Today at 9:28 AM)
Where's Tsuchiya when you need him? I'm sure he'd be up to the challenge... shifty2.gif

hey i bet ya he would be up for the challenge because he showed us that the gumtape deathmatch is possible in an RWD car.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTj0tkrIP_I&feature=related
i bet ya if some one told him to do the cup trick he would prob do it to show its possible in an ae86.
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Posted: Feb 13 2008, 02:39 PM


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I'd like to try this in the Mazda, but unfortunately the cupholders aren't very deep, and they're very close to my window switch. I tried it with a closed cup one time, and as I went through a corner I managed to flip the cup out of the cupholder and into my brother's lap, so I don't try driving with cups anymore. As has been said before, the water in the cup is a nice visual and it definitely shows the importance of being smooth. I would guess if you drove with the cup of water for five years, you'd figure it out. I'm lucky if I can keep my water bottle on the same side of the car when I drive in a "spirited manner".
sideways
Posted: Feb 13 2008, 04:50 PM


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It depends on two things, how smooth the road is- any bumps, no matter how smooth you are, will jolt the water out of the cup- and how much water is actually in the cup. With as full as you see it in the anime itd be nearly impossible to drift at all without spilling- just because the minimum G forces youd see would pull the water out of the cup, no matter how smooth you were.
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Posted: Feb 13 2008, 06:31 PM


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Maybe we should send this idea to Mythbusters. They seem desperate for anything.

As far as rotating the water. It was mainly to shift the weight of the car in a smooth, flowing manner. I've always envisioned it helping Takumi perfect the feint when entering a corner. Seeing the water gives you an extra reference for your brain to process all the forces that are acting on the car.
DeeezNuuuts83
Posted: Feb 13 2008, 06:52 PM


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QUOTE (vwboyaf1 @ Today at 7:31 PM)
Maybe we should send this idea to Mythbusters. They seem desperate for anything.

That would be a terrible idea, I can see it now...

"And to bust this myth, we have our guest pro driver, four-time Winston Cup winner, NASCAR driver Jeff Gordon! He will drive around this oval and not spill a drop of water."
Tessou
Posted: Feb 13 2008, 08:05 PM


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^^ You forgot to add the finishing comment, "This will take every ounce of skill he's got in him." laugh.gif

Realistically, drifting at high speeds while spinning the water in a cup is far too difficult for anybody to do. The road has to be absolutely perfect, with no bumps or potholes to jolt the car. You would also have to be a god at braking since slowing down from high speeds would inevitably pitch the water into the windshield with even a little too much pressure on the brakes. There's many factors that have to match up to make it workable, but it's not impossible... just very very difficult.
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Posted: Feb 13 2008, 09:40 PM


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QUOTE (Tessō @ Today at 8:05 PM)
^^ You forgot to add the finishing comment, "This will take every ounce of skill he's got in him." laugh.gif

Realistically, drifting at high speeds while spinning the water in a cup is far too difficult for anybody to do. The road has to be absolutely perfect, with no bumps or potholes to jolt the car. You would also have to be a god at braking since slowing down from high speeds would inevitably pitch the water into the windshield with even a little too much pressure on the brakes. There's many factors that have to match up to make it workable, but it's not impossible... just very very difficult.

you forgot to factor in the "im thirsty theory"
redgreen
Posted: Feb 14 2008, 12:26 AM


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come to think of it, i wonder how takumi got to practice using gutters with the water. realistically, dropping your wheel tilts your car which would make the water spill for sure.
char
Posted: Feb 14 2008, 01:31 AM


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He only used the gutters on the downhill when he doesnot have Tofu or the cup of water on board
Meteor
Posted: Feb 14 2008, 01:42 AM


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QUOTE
come to think of it, i wonder how takumi got to practice using gutters with the water. realistically, dropping your wheel tilts your car which would make the water spill for sure.

It all started on one winter delivery. Takumi was annoyed at the fact that he had to slow down a lot to turn. So once he got to the hairpins, he took a look at the gutters. Then he had an idea. He dropped his wheels into the gutter before the entry of the turn and just steered.

Three things to keep in mind at this point:
.Takumi was going rather slowly at this point
.The 86's suspension back then was setup to compensate for the tofu
.The cup didn't have that much water back then.

And so dropping the wheels into the gutter didn't cause the water to jump out of the cup.

And gutters don't tilt the car that much.

This post has been edited by Meteor on Feb 14 2008, 01:44 AM
Mister X
Posted: Feb 14 2008, 11:47 AM


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Tsuchiya actually used a spill-proof variant of the cup of water in the drift bible.

On his dashboard, he placed a dome container with a flat base with 3 ball bearings inside. The idea when driving and turning was to keep all 3 ball bearings on the base (not bouncing), and moving together in the same direction, not separately or randomly. During accelleration, you wanted all 3 balls to roll to the back of the dome in unison. Same for braking with the front of the dome. Same for turning, with the left and right sides of the dome.

If you were able to accomplish that, you were driving correctly because your weight shifting was proper.
DeeezNuuuts83
Posted: Feb 14 2008, 12:49 PM


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^ The container wasn't on the dashboard, it's just that the camera view on the balls is shown within the in-car angle. Anyway, I don't think that what you said was the actual intention of the balls. Basic physics will say that all three balls will always move together since the same forces are always acting upon them, so they would never move separately or randomly. I think it was just show to demonstrate how the weight is being transferred (what direction, under acceleration or deceleration, change in velocity, etc.). Plus there's really no reason why the balls would bounce as they're inside a bowl, so they would only roll around, unless Tsuchiya went off of a ramp.

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