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> Looking for opinions on Windows 10
Möbius
Posted: Dec 26 2015, 05:49 PM


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Shout out to N1, I was contemplating giving 10 a trial, but I won't even bother now.
Nomake Wan
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 11:53 AM


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QUOTE (sushiyummy32 @ Yesterday, 3:49 AM)
its automatically on from the day i installed windows 8/10. I dont use that ssd anyway theres nothing in it.

edit: http://i.imgur.com/PNoN4RL.png
huh interesting

So you admit that you have no fucking clue what you're doing. Good to hear.

As for your 'interesting' image, what exactly is interesting about it? That the performance graphs are all over the fucking place? I've got a better performance graph for you, straight from the first few days of testing Windows 10 I did. Yep, that's right folks--I actually used Windows 10 on one of my computers for a whole month before slapping it back to 7. So no, I'm not talking out my ass. I put it through the wringer and came to the conclusion that it's awful by actually (trying) to use it. So here we go.

user posted image
Image size reduced, original size: 960 x 720. Click here to view the image in its original dimension.

So here's the computer sitting there idle...and just kinda...eating away at resources. So that's cool, I guess. Thanks, Windows 10. I mean, the copy of 7 I had on there never did that, but I guess 'it works' so it's totally fine right? Yeah, totally fine.

Except it's not totally fine. The first thing that jumped out at me when I installed 10 was that they started installing things and foisting products on me without my permission. My start menu suddenly had Candy Crush, Twitter and Flipboard on it, as if Microsoft was just sure that they were programs I wanted even though I've never touched them before (and didn't link 10 to a Microsoft account anyway, so with no access to the M$ store, how would they even know if I did?). Installing third-party shit on my machine without my permission? Fuck right off.

Then you have Windows 10 running an application compatibility library designed to test compatibility between 7 and 10...except it keeps on running once you're already on 10 and eats up resources. Thanks, Microsoft! That's really awesome of you! So I went ahead and turned that off, and in the process noticed that it turned on a bunch of shit I had explicitly disabled in 7. Stuff like indexing, antimalware, etc. So I turned those off too. Problem was, when I rebooted the machine those things had been turned back on, because clearly Microsoft knows better than I do about how to run my own machine. Now, there are ways to kill these things (open registry, take ownership of key, change values, lock key from system access) but that you have to hack apart the OS in order to change a simple fucking setting and keep it that way is pure insanity. Fuck right off.

I also noticed that the notification center no longer allows you to disable messages about certain applications or events. For instance, on 7 I specifically told the system not to bother me about not having antivirus or disabling a firewall or any other inane shit I don't give a fuck about because I know what I'm doing, thanks. 10 will continue to bother you about it because it's in your best interest and Microsoft knows better than you do about what you need on your box. That's why they installed Candy Crush for you, after all! Fuck right off.

Ah, except then there is a way to disable those, isn't there? In fact, the way to disable those notifications is exactly where it was in Vista, 7, and 8. It's in the 7-era Control Panel. You know, the one Microsoft said was going to get killed off in order to have a unified interface? Pretty much the one reason (ignoring Start Menu, here) why 10 was going to be better than 8's horrendously broken control panel interfaces? Yeah nah. 10's settings interface is just as broken as 8's, if not more so. So instead of unifying the interface...you break it even more. Fuck right off.

Oh, and after wrecking the registry and fucking with task scheduler...I did finally get 10 to behave hard-drive wise. Mostly, anyway. Here's a before and after HDD benchmark.

http://imgur.com/a/N0Dlt

I went back to 7 and couldn't be happier. If you're a total scrub then I guess you can be happy with 10, but then again you'd probably be just as happy with Linux. smile.gif
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sushiyummy32
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 01:02 PM


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QUOTE (Nomake Wan @ 1 hour, 9 minutes ago)
So you admit that you have no fucking clue what you're doing. Good to hear.

As for your 'interesting' image, what exactly is interesting about it? That the performance graphs are all over the fucking place? I've got a better performance graph for you, straight from the first few days of testing Windows 10 I did. Yep, that's right folks--I actually used Windows 10 on one of my computers for a whole month before slapping it back to 7. So no, I'm not talking out my ass. I put it through the wringer and came to the conclusion that it's awful by actually (trying) to use it. So here we go.

http://i.imgur.com/FuIFV7z.jpg
So here's the computer sitting there idle...and just kinda...eating away at resources. So that's cool, I guess. Thanks, Windows 10. I mean, the copy of 7 I had on there never did that, but I guess 'it works' so it's totally fine right? Yeah, totally fine.

Except it's not totally fine. The first thing that jumped out at me when I installed 10 was that they started installing things and foisting products on me without my permission. My start menu suddenly had Candy Crush, Twitter and Flipboard on it, as if Microsoft was just sure that they were programs I wanted even though I've never touched them before (and didn't link 10 to a Microsoft account anyway, so with no access to the M$ store, how would they even know if I did?). Installing third-party shit on my machine without my permission? Fuck right off.

Then you have Windows 10 running an application compatibility library designed to test compatibility between 7 and 10...except it keeps on running once you're already on 10 and eats up resources. Thanks, Microsoft! That's really awesome of you! So I went ahead and turned that off, and in the process noticed that it turned on a bunch of shit I had explicitly disabled in 7. Stuff like indexing, antimalware, etc. So I turned those off too. Problem was, when I rebooted the machine those things had been turned back on, because clearly Microsoft knows better than I do about how to run my own machine. Now, there are ways to kill these things (open registry, take ownership of key, change values, lock key from system access) but that you have to hack apart the OS in order to change a simple fucking setting and keep it that way is pure insanity. Fuck right off.

I also noticed that the notification center no longer allows you to disable messages about certain applications or events. For instance, on 7 I specifically told the system not to bother me about not having antivirus or disabling a firewall or any other inane shit I don't give a fuck about because I know what I'm doing, thanks. 10 will continue to bother you about it because it's in your best interest and Microsoft knows better than you do about what you need on your box. That's why they installed Candy Crush for you, after all! Fuck right off.

Ah, except then there is a way to disable those, isn't there? In fact, the way to disable those notifications is exactly where it was in Vista, 7, and 8. It's in the 7-era Control Panel. You know, the one Microsoft said was going to get killed off in order to have a unified interface? Pretty much the one reason (ignoring Start Menu, here) why 10 was going to be better than 8's horrendously broken control panel interfaces? Yeah nah. 10's settings interface is just as broken as 8's, if not more so. So instead of unifying the interface...you break it even more. Fuck right off.

Oh, and after wrecking the registry and fucking with task scheduler...I did finally get 10 to behave hard-drive wise. Mostly, anyway. Here's a before and after HDD benchmark.

http://imgur.com/a/N0Dlt

I went back to 7 and couldn't be happier. If you're a total scrub then I guess you can be happy with 10, but then again you'd probably be just as happy with Linux. smile.gif

heh i tried linux and i couldnt even install my graphics drivers because it would tell me to install another thing which it would then tell me to disable some service and i gave up and removed it.
Nomake Wan
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 02:51 PM


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Thank you for further showing that you don't know jack. awesome.gif My aunt, who is a thousand-percent computer illiterate (and a scumbag but I won't get into that) runs Ubuntu on her laptop. If you don't know her that probably doesn't sink in nearly as much, but just realize that she is completely computer stupid. Yet uses Ubuntu no prob.

YOUTUBE ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Qj8p-PEwbI#t=37s )


Look familiar, sushiyummy32? troll.gif
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Tessou
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 02:57 PM


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I will step in if this level of dialogue continues.
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Nomake Wan
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 03:19 PM


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Damn it Tessou, you're ruining all my fun. sad.gif

Windows 10 sucks. Come at me with some actual evidence to the contrary. Refute the evidence I've already presented. Still waitin' on you, Falbere!
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BOZZ
  Posted: Dec 27 2015, 03:22 PM


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QUOTE (Nomake Wan @ 3 hours, 29 minutes ago)
So you admit that you have no fucking clue what you're doing. Good to hear.

As for your 'interesting' image, what exactly is interesting about it? That the performance graphs are all over the fucking place? I've got a better performance graph for you, straight from the first few days of testing Windows 10 I did. Yep, that's right folks--I actually used Windows 10 on one of my computers for a whole month before slapping it back to 7. So no, I'm not talking out my ass. I put it through the wringer and came to the conclusion that it's awful by actually (trying) to use it. So here we go.

http://i.imgur.com/FuIFV7z.jpg
So here's the computer sitting there idle...and just kinda...eating away at resources. So that's cool, I guess. Thanks, Windows 10. I mean, the copy of 7 I had on there never did that, but I guess 'it works' so it's totally fine right? Yeah, totally fine.

Except it's not totally fine. The first thing that jumped out at me when I installed 10 was that they started installing things and foisting products on me without my permission. My start menu suddenly had Candy Crush, Twitter and Flipboard on it, as if Microsoft was just sure that they were programs I wanted even though I've never touched them before (and didn't link 10 to a Microsoft account anyway, so with no access to the M$ store, how would they even know if I did?). Installing third-party shit on my machine without my permission? Fuck right off.

Then you have Windows 10 running an application compatibility library designed to test compatibility between 7 and 10...except it keeps on running once you're already on 10 and eats up resources. Thanks, Microsoft! That's really awesome of you! So I went ahead and turned that off, and in the process noticed that it turned on a bunch of shit I had explicitly disabled in 7. Stuff like indexing, antimalware, etc. So I turned those off too. Problem was, when I rebooted the machine those things had been turned back on, because clearly Microsoft knows better than I do about how to run my own machine. Now, there are ways to kill these things (open registry, take ownership of key, change values, lock key from system access) but that you have to hack apart the OS in order to change a simple fucking setting and keep it that way is pure insanity. Fuck right off.

I also noticed that the notification center no longer allows you to disable messages about certain applications or events. For instance, on 7 I specifically told the system not to bother me about not having antivirus or disabling a firewall or any other inane shit I don't give a fuck about because I know what I'm doing, thanks. 10 will continue to bother you about it because it's in your best interest and Microsoft knows better than you do about what you need on your box. That's why they installed Candy Crush for you, after all! Fuck right off.

Ah, except then there is a way to disable those, isn't there? In fact, the way to disable those notifications is exactly where it was in Vista, 7, and 8. It's in the 7-era Control Panel. You know, the one Microsoft said was going to get killed off in order to have a unified interface? Pretty much the one reason (ignoring Start Menu, here) why 10 was going to be better than 8's horrendously broken control panel interfaces? Yeah nah. 10's settings interface is just as broken as 8's, if not more so. So instead of unifying the interface...you break it even more. Fuck right off.

Oh, and after wrecking the registry and fucking with task scheduler...I did finally get 10 to behave hard-drive wise. Mostly, anyway. Here's a before and after HDD benchmark.

http://imgur.com/a/N0Dlt

I went back to 7 and couldn't be happier. If you're a total scrub then I guess you can be happy with 10, but then again you'd probably be just as happy with Linux. smile.gif

Jeez, with every post you make about Windows 10 it definitely is proving your point about how terrible it seems to be and reinforcing my belief that I should stay far, far away from it; so far the only problem I've had as of late with Windows 7 is that you can't fully disable the "Upgrade to Windows 10 notification", you can only hide it.

This post has been edited by BOZZ on Dec 27 2015, 03:22 PM
Nomake Wan
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 03:28 PM


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QUOTE (BOZZ @ 6 minutes, 2 seconds ago)
So far the only problem I've had as of late with Windows 7 is that you can't fully disable the "Upgrade to Windows 10 notification", you can only hide it.

Not true. Run this script, then run the GWX Control Panel. For some reason running the script will break Windows Update notifications, but GWX Control Panel's reset functionality restores it to normal.

Only thing you have to be sure you do once you run the script is to make sure you hide the updates the script removes the next time you check for updates. If you do not do this, then the next time you go to update you'll reinstall the very updates you bothered to remove.

This post has been edited by Nomake Wan on Dec 27 2015, 03:28 PM
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sushiyummy32
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 03:28 PM


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i dont know why or how discussing win 10 would end up in you trying to insult me.
Nomake Wan
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 03:31 PM


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Because you were attempting to make an argument for Windows 10 being an operating system where--and I quote--everything works, and that it's perfectly good for normal use. Because you backed up your 'argument' by providing evidence that you know absolutely nothing about the subject at hand and therefore have no business being a party to the discussion. Because after several posts where this was made clear you continued to post, and at that point it just becomes a joke.

That explanation should suffice.
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BOZZ
  Posted: Dec 27 2015, 03:35 PM


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QUOTE (Nomake Wan @ 7 minutes, 4 seconds ago)
Not true. Run this script, then run the GWX Control Panel. For some reason running the script will break Windows Update notifications, but GWX Control Panel's reset functionality restores it to normal.

Only thing you have to be sure you do once you run the script is to make sure you hide the updates the script removes the next time you check for updates. If you do not do this, then the next time you go to update you'll reinstall the very updates you bothered to remove.

Sweet, thanks for the heads up, I'll try that out.

At the very least, I'm happy there is a way to prevent Windows Update from auto downloading Windows 10 by editing the registry.
Tessou
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 03:48 PM


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QUOTE (Nomake Wan @ 29 minutes, 39 seconds ago)
Damn it Tessou, you're ruining all my fun. sad.gif

Only because I love you so much. wink2.gif
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Nomake Wan
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 03:55 PM


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QUOTE (BOZZ @ 18 minutes, 23 seconds ago)
Sweet, thanks for the heads up, I'll try that out.

At the very least, I'm happy there is a way to prevent Windows Update from auto downloading Windows 10 by editing the registry.

Haven't had to edit the registry on my end, but whatever works!

QUOTE (Tessou @ 4 minutes, 55 seconds ago)
Only because I love you so much. wink2.gif

I hate that I haven't met you in person yet. shifty2.gif
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Posted: Dec 27 2015, 06:50 PM


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QUOTE (BOZZ @ 3 hours, 28 minutes ago)
Jeez, with every post you make about Windows 10 it definitely is proving your point about how terrible it seems to be and reinforcing my belief that I should stay far, far away from it; so far the only problem I've had as of late with Windows 7 is that you can't fully disable the "Upgrade to Windows 10 notification", you can only hide it.

same here. i know no new OS will be without its "teething issues" though W10 takes it to a while new level. the fact that microsoft thinks it knows better than you and does things without your consent is very scary.
Shirogane
Posted: Dec 27 2015, 11:10 PM


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I just got a new laptop to replace the Lenovo Y50, and there's always a day when I wish it came with 8.1 instead. As much as I love the start menu... It had to be everything else that left a sour taste in my mouth.

At least I still have a locale emulator... But that's it.

This post has been edited by Shirogane on Dec 27 2015, 11:10 PM
Spaz
Posted: Dec 28 2015, 07:20 AM


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I've got 7 on my old desktop which is now acting as a server, and 8.1 on my new box. Neither will be updated to 10.

I haven't had an issue with 10 on my Surface Pro 2, but I usually just use that for garage stuff, Netflix, and web browsing, occasional photo editing, so I really haven't found much of anything to complain about performance-wise. It works, and that's what I care about.
Sensation!
Posted: Dec 28 2015, 09:31 PM


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QUOTE (Spaz @ Today, 8:20 AM)
so I really haven't found much of anything to complain about performance-wise. It works, and that's what I care about.

Agreed.

QUOTE (Nomake Wan)
Because you were attempting to make an argument for Windows 10 being an operating system where--and I quote--everything works, and that it's perfectly good for normal use.


Taken slightly out of context, but mild disagree with your point.


My final pennies are these:

10 needs to work. Outside of bugs, the only thing that makes 10 a miss rather than a hit for me is MS's insistence that it knows what drivers and other software should be on your machine.

I have a feeling they'll change this once they realize
A. they're being flooded with complaints and it isn't worth it
B. The risk of rolling a bad hardware patch and ruining several machines, something that is likely to happen and MS should realize soon that.....it isn't worth it...

The moment W10 allows at LEAST pro users to select which updates to install and which to hide is the moment i'm okay with 10. Thats all it takes.

10 needs some tweaking, but even amidst its bloat, it is very snappy and does perform quite well, but this could just be my hardware making up for it.

So in defense of KiwiArteezy, windows 10 ISNT perfect, not by a long shot, but it IS suitable for normal use. I do work with it, and I know the computers at a subsidiary of a certain italian brake company use 10 as well. An OS doesn't have to be perfect for normal, or even enterprise use. No OS is perfect anyway.



Why did I roll with 10 and not 7 or 8.1 even though i clearly have he choice to go with either? Total mean uptime.

7,8.1, and 10 all require some initial tweaking for me. 10 more so than the others. But its not a big deal.

Sticking with 10's bullshit now means I wont have to deal with performing a fresh install of 10 later. I only do fresh installs anyway..and yes, I'm implying that 10 will eventually be good.

This post has been edited by Sensation! on Dec 28 2015, 09:32 PM
Falbere
Posted: Dec 28 2015, 10:54 PM


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Here is MY windows 10 when it sits around and do nothing.
user posted image
Image size reduced, original size: 701 x 639. Click here to view the image in its original dimension.

As you can see, I do not have any disk usage at all. That problem is clearly only on your end N1.

I am not a power user, but please don't get me wrong. I did not recommend updating to 10 if he was in 7. I said upgrade if you like your auto updates always turned on and you are already on windows 8. Windows 8 already merged a quarter of the control panel anyway. Merging a bit more of it does not seem to be an issue on my end.

Also, sorry for the late reply. I prettymuch never went past the broad index these few days.

This post has been edited by Falbere on Dec 28 2015, 10:57 PM
Nomake Wan
Posted: Dec 28 2015, 11:00 PM


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QUOTE (Falbere @ 5 minutes, 21 seconds ago)
Here is MY windows 10 when it sits around and do nothing. As you can see, I do not have any disk usage at all. That problem is clearly only on your end N1.

I am not a power user, but please don't get me wrong. I did not recommend updating to 10 if he was in 7. I said upgrade if you like your auto updates always turned on and you are already on windows 8. Windows 8 already merged a quarter of the control panel anyway. Merging a bit more of it does not seem to be an issue on my end.

It was on the end of Windows 10, actually. I managed to fix it after a day's worth of tweaking settings both in Task Scheduler and the registry itself. I forget if I mentioned it here--I mentioned it on my Facebook when I first got 10--but I managed to get my machine to boot to desktop in 20 seconds and be useable in 40, which considering its primary drive was a shitty refurbished 5400 RPM Fujitsu was impressive.

My point is you shouldn't have to. My point is I know what I'm doing and 10 still left me scratching my head. My point is that 10 still has several rather ridiculous huge bugs that Sensation! left out of his post above. If you don't run into any issues, I can only assume that you wouldn't run into any running Ubuntu either.

But please, Falbere. I am still waiting for you to detail evidence on XP including a keylogger and 7 including advanced spy features as you claim. I believe we would all benefit from such an education.
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Falbere
Posted: Dec 28 2015, 11:14 PM


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For one, I did not tweak anything or mess with the registry. That hard drive usage is what came with my windows 10 on clean install.

As for the boot speed, I agree that it runs pretty well. I am on a nice SSD here and it prettymuch can open chrome tabs 10 second after i click the power button.

As for the bugs, as I am more of a normie guy (who leaves auto updates on), The bugs are either being patched or patching up. I have heard the weird error sounds when shutting down before. But they had not been happening recently.

Of course, Microsoft could've done better in many ways. But for a very casual user like me, Most of the Windows OSes works just fine for my daily task of browsing the web and occasionally playing videogames.

As for Ubuntu. Well, you see, Windows have a lot of retard-proof things in place. While on linux: Oh you want to delete your OS drive? Sure!

Not saying Ubuntu is bad, actually less restrictions is preferred by many people as well. It just depends on how much of fail-proofing you need. I am sticking to Windows 10, not because I don't love Windows 7, but because I already switched to a Windows 8 pre-laoded laptop now (and the UEFI stuff really seem to hate windows 7 for some reason), Since 8 and 10 are both crap, why not stick with fresher crap?
Nomake Wan
Posted: Dec 28 2015, 11:23 PM


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Oh, so you were on an SSD where you wouldn't have noticed any of the issues with mechanical hard drives posted above. Thanks for the clarification.

And yet again you have intentionally--I can only assume--avoided providing evidence for your own earlier argument. Please provide evidence that Windows XP included a keylogger. Please provide evidence that 7 is as intrusive as 10. These are your arguments, so the onus is on you to either provide evidence or retract your statements. I'm still waiting.
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Falbere
Posted: Dec 28 2015, 11:25 PM


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I was wrong.
APX
Posted: Dec 28 2015, 11:26 PM


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Now gobble them nuts.
Sensation!
Posted: Dec 29 2015, 08:35 PM


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QUOTE (Nomake Wan @ Today, 12:00 AM)
rather ridiculous huge bugs that Sensation! left out of his post above

Generally, If I don't notice it, I tend to not care about it until I do.
Ignorance is bliss after all.

That said, I decided to comb the thread a bit more, perhaps I may have missed something you might have brought up that I do care about.

So I came upon the whole Windows 8/10 defragging your SSD issue as I glanced over it initially, and I thought I'd clear a few things up by doing a PSA which will make Kiwiarteezy play Dota in relative relief again, but first, a relevant story. Especially one that pertains to being blissfully ignorant until its too late....

..or so i thought.

About, 5 months ago, I noticed my Windows 8 laptop cranking away on one of its HDD.
QUOTE
huh?

Sure enough, the disk was being worked on, but what exactly? I wasn't downloading anything.
Well, eventually by looking through some services, windows was currently defragging my disk.

QUOTE
doh!, I left it on a schedule! for a year!

but then, I noticed something much more disturbing, this time pertaining to my boot drive..
QUOTE
C: Solid State Drive OK (last run 0 days ago)
Schedule: WEEKLY

OH MY GOD. I HAVE BEEN DEFRAGGING MY SSD ONCE A WEEK FOR A YEAR NOW.

I just about blew up my laptop right then and there. It's a Thinkpad, it'll endure much in the amount of impacts against solid objects from sheer rage.
My heart just about sank.

QUOTE
Gee, I wonder when I'll be needing a new SSD, I wonder how much life this things got left on it. It hasn't given me any trouble, yet...

Curiosity ultimately got the better of me.
QUOTE
Fuck it....Just one more time

I highlighted the drive, mouse cursor over the optimize button..
QUOTE
*click*


Now, I don't recommend burning yourself with a lighter to find out whether or not fire is ACTUALLY hot. But I will conclude the story real shortly here.


But first...
This is the windows 8/10 drive optimization menu, and here it is on my desktop machine.
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SOLID STATE DRIVE. 20 DAYS SINCE LAST RUN. SCHEDULE: MONTHLY
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!YOU WERE THE CHOSEN ONE! YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO DESTROY THE SITH, NOT JOIN THEM. YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO BRING BALANCE TO THE FORCE, NOT LEAVE IT IN DARKNESS.

Now, now. Calm yourselves ladies and gents. If this were Windows 7, yes, my SSD was de-fragged 20 days ago.

But its not 7. The optimize drive and defrag options of 8 and 10 work a bit differently and Microsoft is EXTREMELY vague about it.

So what happens if you click on optimize for a SSD?
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It doesn't Defrag the SSD. In fact if windows detects your drive as a SSD. It will never defrag it. Ever. Only You can choose to defrag it by going into CMD and affixing /D to the command.

The optimize button and functions is equivalent to the parameter /O. Such as Defrag c: /o
If windows detects your drive as a SSD, the /o parameter will ALWAYS trim the drive, if it sees it as a HDD, it will ALWAYS defrag it.

So to conclude my story. I sighed in relief. The end.

Because 7(when configured properly), 8 and 10 is performing TRIM for you, it makes sense to leave the schedule on (for 8 and 10). You can tick which drives need to be optimized, which in my case, is my SSD only, the HDD's don't need to be defragged. Thus Windows will ONLY retrim my SSD once a month. Thats it.

Hope it clears a few things up.

This post has been edited by Sensation! on Dec 29 2015, 09:10 PM
Nomake Wan
Posted: Dec 29 2015, 10:20 PM


ShiMACHaze
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Oh word, today I learned that TRIM is handled properly by default but that it's done through Defrag for some ungodly reason (which I assume is M$ being lazy and reusing an interface rather than creating a new one).

Cool, so I'll retract one negative point from 8/8.1/10. Still grossly in the negative, but hey, it's one point closer to zero! awesome.gif
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