Printable Version of Topic
Click here to view this topic in its original format |
Initial D World - Discussion Board / Forums > Anime and Manga > EVANGELION BD BOX |
Posted by: kyonpalm Dec 1 2014, 08:16 AM |
Image size reduced, original size: unknown. http://i.minus.com/iwQdX5i5y9Tth.jpg to view the image in its original dimension. http://www.evangelion.co.jp/sp/ng.html IT'S FUCKING HAPPENING. |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Dec 1 2014, 07:26 PM |
IT'S ABOUT GODDAMN TIME |
Posted by: kyonpalm Dec 1 2014, 07:33 PM |
Taking bets on the retail for this thing. I'm thinking $1,000. |
Posted by: Rudy Dec 1 2014, 07:35 PM |
Took them long enough. Christ... |
Posted by: THE_HONDA_CG2 Dec 1 2014, 08:19 PM |
I'm a fan of the series and all, but I don't think $1000 will justify any blu-ray purchase of mine unless it includes about $800+ worth of goodies and extras. |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Dec 2 2014, 06:28 AM | ||
Japanese BD prices disregard your silly American concept of value. |
Posted by: Seri Dec 2 2014, 07:13 AM |
Guys, it's Evangelion. Gainax isn't stupid, they know they can get more. $1500. |
Posted by: THE_HONDA_CG2 Dec 2 2014, 08:44 AM | ||
Dohoho. Forgive me. We have yen signs for that. [ Post made via Mobile Device ] |
Posted by: kyonpalm Dec 2 2014, 08:45 AM | ||
I'm basing my 1k on the fact that the Gurren Lagann box was $700. I am, for the record, being 100% serious when I say $1,000. |
Posted by: Rudy Dec 2 2014, 08:45 AM |
That's totally not right... |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Dec 3 2014, 08:39 AM | ||
Again, please note that the Japanese completely disregard your filthy gaijin concepts of value. I believe I've already done this once before, but let's review, shall we? Average Eroge (New): ~9000 yen Average Anime Bluray Boxset (13 episodes): 23000 yen Average Anime Bluray Boxset (25 episodes): 35000 yen Average New Film Bluray: 6000 yen Of course, then you have what I consider to be the true value... Average JAV (HD): 2000 yen Why? Well it's simple. Your average JAV has like 4 hours of content for 2000 yen. Of course, then you can argue that the content is not nearly as complex or detailed as the content of the above items but meh! Meh I says! Now of course, please do keep in mind that the US hasn't been totally exempt from ridiculous pricing either. Ignoring Aniplex's verbatim import of Japanese media pricing, let's go with an older example, shall we? Star Trek: The Next Generation DVD Boxset: $700 Star Trek: Voyager DVD Boxset: $500 As a note, with current pricing the blurays for ST:TNG would come out to $420. Now, the difference here is that you're getting an entire season of Star Trek remastered in 1080p from scratch for $60 a pop. This is in stark contrast to Japan, where 6000 yen nets you...a few episodes of an Anime, at best? I believe the DVDs for Wangan Midnight were $60 each (and had two episodes per DVD). So while $420 is expensive, sure, it's not as expensive as you'd think. The DVD boxsets were way more expensive and were transfers from VHS masters. Anyway, those are some quick numbers. Note I was going with MSRP on all of these, so I'm sure you can get everything here for cheaper nowadays if you tried. Doesn't change the facts, though. |
Posted by: kyonpalm Dec 3 2014, 10:51 AM | ||
Going further on that topic, http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/feature/2012-03-07
|
Posted by: Rudy Dec 3 2014, 12:41 PM |
That makes sense, I guess, but $90 an episode is a really hard pill to swallow. But how could anime only be supported by its fans. What about the profits from the tv networks, and/or sponsor money from commercials and profits from syndication/reruns? Anime can't be THAT expensive to make, can it? And finally, what happens once ADV picks up this box set and sells it stateside? What will the price be - and how much licensing money do the creators get? |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Dec 4 2014, 01:42 AM | ||
I'm not sure where you're getting your $90-an-episode figure. Even if we go with Kyonpalm's $1500 figure, that puts each episode at $57.70. At $1000 it'd be $38.46. However, regardless of the number, this is not a value you have to stomach. Keep in mind that this is the Japanese market and we have heard nothing about an international release. Unless you're planning on importing this boxset yourself and adding it to your collection despite it being entirely in Japanese, then the entire discussion is moot for you. As to the rest of your post, however, almost all Anime has traditionally been supported by its goods. Primarily the DVD/bluray sales, yes, but also the associated goods such as OSTs, OP/ED singles, character CDs, posters, figures, etc etc etc. It's the sale of physical goods that keeps shows afloat and this is not new in any way, shape or form. I don't know when this concept started, but I do know that at least as far back as 1979 with Mobile Suit Gundam it has been a thing. Networks, commercials and syndication are a pittance. I don't have any hard numbers for you but I do know that without the sale of physical goods a series dies. Plain and simple. Anime can't be that expensive to make, can it? Now I know that you are disconnected from the reality of the industry. I happen to have hard numbers for at least two Anime from back in 2007, Bamboo Blade and Toaru Majutsu no Index. Bamboo Blade was a two-cours show which apparently operated on something of a shoestring budget, costing only roughly 10,000,000 yen (http://bakudon.net/news/2008/02/27/financials-heaven-hell-reality-three-looks-at-the-business-of-animation-production-part-3-an-examination-of-the-production-costs-of-bamboo-blade). Toaru, on the other hand, apparently cost 300,000,000 yen (!!) to produce (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/interest/2011-11-29/toaru-majutsu-no-index-producer/26-episode-anime-costs-300-million-yen). So a shoestring budget is roughly $100,000. A blockbuster series like Toaru is $3,000,000. That's a lot of money. Now, do note that this is production from scratch. This topic is about a bluray remaster for Evangelion. Now, either they can go the Nuku Nuku/Initial D route and just upscale the original masters (which looks like absolute shit), which is super easy and super sleazy, and is essentially printing money since the cost would essentially just be media and distribution. If, however, they're actually going back and re-shooting the cels (that is, if they have the original film still to shoot from), then that's quite a bit of cost going into essentially creating entirely new digital masters from an analog format. Done right this looks spectacular (check out the blurays for Turn A Gundam, which was mastered from 35mm film as an example), but done wrong it can look blurry or off-color. Basically, to make sure that a smash series like Evangelion gets it done right they're not going to let some scrub conversion house do it. This is gonna cost some serious dosh to get done right. As much as producing a new series? Probably not, but it will still cost a pretty penny. And finally, you're not exactly Mr. Current Events. ADV no longer exists and hasn't for several years. As far as I'm aware it's FUNimation that holds the Evangelion rights as they're the distributor for Rebuild, but we'll see. They will likely price it somewhere between what we consider 'normal' price and what Japanese consider 'normal' price if it's localized. They still have to offset their own costs, after all--going over the digital masters and adding the English content--so while I doubt they'd charge anywhere near $1000 for the boxset it will definitely be over $100. I know this because the retail cost for Robotics;Notes, a 22-episode series, was $120. Steins;Gate--25 episodes--was $160. Now, both have dropped to $50 and $25 (!) as it's been quite a long time since they came out, but yeah. As for how much the licensing process costs/nets, I do not have figures for that. |
Posted by: kyonpalm Dec 4 2014, 08:54 AM | ||||||||||||||||
That was Miura Seri's figure, for the record. My bet was $1,000.
It is also for this reason we will never have Nichijou S2.
If soundtracks count as goods-supporting-the-series, that goes way back. Yamato had soundtrack LPs and plenty of series had records released as early as the '60s (I have a Speed Racer promotional flexi, for instance).
I'M CAAALIIING THE STAR RISE
While "Kill Me Baby" ran on payments of pocket lint and rubber bands (AND WE STILL WON'T SEE A SECOND SEASON).
Another good example is the outstanding job done on Serial Experiments Lain's remaster. I compare any other remaster job to that one. Image size reduced, original size: 1520 x 1080. http://i.minus.com/ibtMgzq6f2BF6O.jpg to view the image in its original dimension.
I have my doubts that it'll even be brought over here. Importing (from America to Japan) is a real concern, since one could just buy an US pressing and instantly save literally hundreds. That said, it would be a massive moneymaker here, so I think they'll probably just wait some months before putting it out stateside. |
Posted by: Rudy Dec 4 2014, 01:02 PM |
There's also the possibility of a trade agreement coming with a set price. Yes, I admit, I haven't really been "into" anime since 2006 or so so I'm not fully up to speed on a lot of things so I thank you for the 411 on all of this. It makes me take a step back and see with full perspective just how much is involved in creating and maintaining a series. Makes me wanna buy more anime merchandise. And I could have swore Nonake you said a new episode was $90... Interesting the more I mull things over, I'd happily pay $150-200 for each season of Friendship is Magic, if only Hasbro got their shit together and made A BLU RAY RELEASE. I don't even care if it's upscaled 720p (which the tv releases are anyway), JUST GIVE ME MY PONY BDs. ...maybe that's the Japanese anime fan mentality? |
Posted by: Seri Feb 2 2015, 08:15 AM |
So remember those 1000+ estimates? http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2015/02/02-1/remastered-neon-genesis-evangelion-blu-ray-release-plans-announced |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Feb 2 2015, 10:21 AM | ||
>only 38000 yen |
Posted by: THE_HONDA_CG2 Feb 2 2015, 09:29 PM | ||
I'm feelin this. I'm feelin this very strongly. If only my paychecks were big enough to support this in addition to my rent and food costs though... |
Posted by: Rudy Feb 3 2015, 08:36 PM |
If it offered any form of English language I'd be blowing my wad on this instead of box mods and car parts. Seriously. |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Feb 3 2015, 10:20 PM | ||
It's not unheard of for established DVD series to include English dubs when released on bluray in Japan (Utawarerumono, for instance, was dual-audio), but the Gainax page doesn't list specifications for the audio/video of the boxsets so we have no way of knowing just yet. I did just notice that the bluray set includes a bonus 5.1ch master of the 22-track OST. That's...impressive. |
Posted by: Falbere Feb 3 2015, 10:24 PM | ||
It is not very often to have dual-audio though. most of them is just Japanese, some of them english subbed, right? |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Feb 3 2015, 11:00 PM | ||
It's more common to feature a dub than it is to feature a sub if I'm recalling correctly. |
Posted by: kyonpalm Aug 27 2015, 10:46 AM | ||
UPDATE: IT'S STILL FUCKING HAPPENING. Image size reduced, original size: 1440 x 1080. http://i.minus.com/i4uoflxx3gpwz.png to view the image in its original dimension. Image size reduced, original size: 1920 x 1080. http://i.minus.com/ieOxc3Oi2v13i.png to view the image in its original dimension. Image size reduced, original size: 2560 x 1080. http://i.minus.com/ibzpyxaXxHZFrJ.png to view the image in its original dimension. Now the wait for rips. |
Posted by: xiao Aug 27 2015, 11:27 AM | ||
hahaha... oh Shinji, even in high-def it still doesn't count. XD |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Aug 27 2015, 01:09 PM |
Yeah, saw the BDMVs hit but no matter how much I love Eva, 30GB for a movie is excessive. Especially since I don't have BDRs laying around to burn onto anyway. What I don't get is why a bunch of people released different versions of episode 1. Come on guys, the good stuff is in episode 2! Hurry it up! Did see a rip of the OP. I hope it's just a poor encode on the encoder's side, but the white balance seemed way off to me. Will wait until a proper group releases something to do a proper check. |
Posted by: kyonpalm Aug 27 2015, 01:35 PM | ||
Do you mean a bunch of different groups releasing episode 1 or a bunch of groups, releasing different versions of episode 1? If the former, it's probably just everyone scrambling for some of the spotlight. If the latter, maybe the different versions are the different versions included in the box set (TV broadcast version and original master transfer). |
Posted by: Tessou Aug 27 2015, 01:56 PM |
Why would they include an inferior version of something that was taken from the existing master on the disc? |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Aug 27 2015, 03:09 PM | ||
The former, the former. As far as I can tell everyone's jumping on the very same BDMV and doing the exact same thing. They all got ep1 out SUPAFAHST but then...nothing. When a new Evangelion release rears its head I always use Episode 2 to test with, so this is kinda irritating, haha. |
Posted by: kyonpalm Aug 27 2015, 03:46 PM | ||
2D4U have been the standard for the old DVD rips, and they're doing the BDs, so they might come out on top again. |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Aug 27 2015, 05:32 PM |
Encode of EoE is out. Flipping through it before I leave for class, I notice some odd horizontal tearing. I really didn't want to download 30GB of BDMV but I might have to at this rate to see if the problem is on the source or encode end... Would suck if the source had tearing. I mean this is supposed to be a film transfer so there shouldn't be any digital artifacts like that. EDIT: Screenshots of an example below. Image size reduced, original size: 853 x 480. http://i.imgur.com/u1lEi5Y.jpg to view the image in its original dimension. Image size reduced, original size: 853 x 480. http://i.imgur.com/u192B1g.jpg to view the image in its original dimension. (You'll have to open both in a tab and flip between the tabs; stupid IDW's resize filter broke the ability to see them side by side) EDIT 2: So after watching it some more, I ran across this interesting shot about the "Third Impact," or rather NERV's sensor data about the start of the Third Impact. Image size reduced, original size: 1920 x 1080. http://i.imgur.com/FBty3j0.jpg to view the image in its original dimension. I guess they figured that back then no one would ever see this stuff...but it's 2015, and we totally did, so here's the actual game that the code shown here is from : http://www.kirkvs.com/anonpost/GearHeads/ |
Posted by: xiao Aug 28 2015, 11:48 AM | ||
hahaha, nice catch! Guess now we know what Gainax was doing when they weren't working... I'm surprised given the individual members' background, they never made a little 'cade game or something. I mean, look at Anno and Sadamoto making Nadia shorts for Kenichi Sonoda's Chosen Ame doujin years ago. |
Posted by: Nomake Wan Sep 1 2015, 01:55 PM |
Well, someone finally encoded Episode 2 in a not-hard-drive-destroying filesize so I gave it a look. For the most part I'm pretty pleased by the transfer. It seems they're using a new audio track, but I suppose it could be because it's been so many years since I saw the original that I don't remember all of these sound effects and background noises. Or it could be like the Nadesico BDs and I'm spot-on. I'd have to go back and check my DVDs but I don't have them on me at the moment. The really good news is that it turns out the OP I watched earlier really was a shitty encode. The white balance in the OP of this episode is much closer to correct, so much so that it's obvious that the previous encoder went a little overboard with filters. In using almost no filtering, this time around it looks much, much better. There are still a few things that bother me, like scenes that have quality drops unlike the rest of the sequence and bits where there seems to be a little bit of judder or tearing to my eye, but like I said...a mostly positive experience. Let's do some screenshots, starting off with one of the lackluster shots of the episode and moving on to some of the more impressive. Image size reduced, original size: 960 x 720. http://i.imgur.com/xaEcQJZ.jpg to view the image in its original dimension. Image size reduced, original size: 960 x 720. http://i.imgur.com/SXHsxyG.jpg to view the image in its original dimension. Image size reduced, original size: 960 x 720. http://i.imgur.com/3mGytCT.jpg to view the image in its original dimension. Image size reduced, original size: 960 x 720. http://i.imgur.com/XJJ8grJ.jpg to view the image in its original dimension. Image size reduced, original size: 960 x 720. http://i.imgur.com/8RDxMJ3.jpg to view the image in its original dimension. Image size reduced, original size: 960 x 720. http://i.imgur.com/kqQC5AO.jpg to view the image in its original dimension. |